Ask your senator to vote against HR 6304 (right now please. thanx)

[netmouse]

To quote Novapsyche's post, there is still time to call your Senators regarding the capitulation on FISA (aka, the evisceration of the 4th Amendment).

The bill is H.R. 6304 and i have seen it described as a confirmation of the legal king model of government since it basically protects people (in this case, telecommunication companies) from being prosecuted for illegal activities because the president asked them to do them.

I would prefer to live in a country where presidential fiat does not make it ok for people to break the law, especially regarding the privacy of citizens, and in order for that to be true, we need to defeat this bill. please call your senator now.

Comments

[grimfaire.livejournal.com]

Sure it does... our system doesn't have a method for a "no contest" or "no confidence" vote of our system so the only method left to us before revolution is to break the system.

We could just as well get 100 million to vote for donal duck to achieve the same results.

[cos]

You're not going to get 100 million votes for Donald Duck. Or "against all incumbents", either.

If you want to change legislators' behavior on some issue and your strategy is to vote against both your allies and your opponents, you will A) not get much support for your strategy, hence not a lot of votes, and B) not get any coherent message to legislators, either the incumbents or new ones who get elected, about what it is that they should do to win your votes. Hence, you will achieve nothing. Really.

This strategy is similar to the neocon/Bush global strategy of "just beat all the bad guys". It sounds like it makes sense only if you neither understand the system you're trying to affect, nor do you have any interest in understanding it, and at its best (if you achieve enough power to really do it), it can cause a lot of damage, but can't get you what you want (unless all you want is "a lot of damage" - but it does bit you in the ass too).

[grimfaire.livejournal.com]

What you don't get is that I fully understand the system and therein lies the problem. The system is broke with no chance of repair.

You start with basic idea of a two party system which over time has evolved into a 1 party system... I'm sorry but other then monikers there is no realistic difference between dems and republicans... whomever throws more money at the official gets their vote. They talk differently but act the same.

Personally, I'd more for just truly educate everyone and then you wouldn't have this problem but since we get no choice with the current system, we have to think of another way. The best we can hope for with the system as it is, is to elect gridlock and have a completely inefectual government that is incapable of doing anything which means at the very least it can't do any harm.

I'd rather put my trust in Joe across the hall who has to live in the shit he shovels than people who spend most if not all of their adult lives isolated from everyone else in society. We've created our own nobility class in members of congress.

[cos]

What you don't get is that I fully understand the system

The rest of your comment strongly suggests otherwise, and also suggests that you don't even see what system it is, let alone understand how it works. However, I'll drop it now, because a real answer would take way more time than I have.

[grimfaire.livejournal.com]

hahaha I love it... because someone doesn't agree with you and/or has a different method of looking at things... they obviously don't understand it.

Must be nice in your world.

[cos]

I said I'd drop it, but you did bring up a tangent that I'm curious about, separately from the main point, so I'll ask: What made you conclude that the reason I thought your comment suggests you don't understand how the democratic system works, is simply that you disagree with me? I don't think I gave any indication of what it was about your comment led me to think it suggests that you don't understand, and you certainly said a lot more than just "I disagree", so why that rather strange conclusion on your part?

[knightlygoddess.livejournal.com]

I once wrote in "Snoopy" as my vote for a local election - and he received two votes. So I wasn't the only person of the mind to vote for a make-believe character.

[cos]

There are always a few write-in votes like that in almost every election. They have no effect, of course, because they're individual & disorganized. Perhaps they make some voters feel better, perhaps they amuse someone (well, I know they amuse me sometimes), but as far as making political change they're completely pointless votes.

[arkaycee.livejournal.com]

This strategy is similar to the neocon/Bush global strategy of "just beat all the bad guys".

(big nod in agreement). Locking people up at Gitmo as illegal combatants in the War on Terror comes to mind. To me, it's like the War on Bank Robbery. As long as there are banks, there will be robberies, and we can't just lock up bank robbers permanently, if that's how you define when to start letting out illegal combatants. For one big thing, there are probably thousands of terrorists and terrorist groups, each with their own individual goal, and many of whose goals are in absolute conflict with each other. Unless human nature changes, that'll never change, which is sad but true.